• Home
  • Latest
  • Fortune 500
  • Finance
  • Tech
  • Leadership
  • Lifestyle
  • Rankings
  • Multimedia

Trendingnow

1

After forcing workers back to the office, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase are now letting their staff work remotely—but only for the World Cup

2

The Pentagon said Iran War costs $29 billion, but the real cost is closer to $200 billion—and counting

3

Amazon's record Prime Day masks a darker truth: Americans are spending more and getting less

1

After forcing workers back to the office, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase are now letting their staff work remotely—but only for the World Cup

2

The Pentagon said Iran War costs $29 billion, but the real cost is closer to $200 billion—and counting

3

Amazon's record Prime Day masks a darker truth: Americans are spending more and getting less
Tech Visionaries

When Steve Met Bill: ‘It was a kind of weird seduction visit’

Fortune Editors
By
Fortune Editors
Fortune Editors
Down Arrow Button Icon
Fortune Editors
By
Fortune Editors
Fortune Editors
Down Arrow Button Icon
October 24, 2011, 12:01 AM ET
Add Fortune on Google for similar content.

FORTUNE — The complex relationship between Bill Gates and Steve Jobs began in the late 1970s, when Microsoft was making most of its money writing software for the Apple II. When Jobs began developing the original Macintosh in the early 1980s, he wanted Microsoft to create for it a version of BASIC, an easy-to-use programming language, as well as some application software, such as word processing, charts, and spreadsheet programs. So he flew up to visit Gates in his office near Seattle and spun an enticing vision of what the Macintosh would be: a computer for the masses, with a friendly graphical interface. Gates signed on to do graphical versions of a new spreadsheet called Excel, a word-processing program called Word, as well as BASIC.

Gates frequently went down to Cupertino for demonstrations of the Macintosh operating system, and he was not very impressed. “I remember the first time we went down, Steve had this app where it was just things bouncing around on the screen,” he told me. “That was the only app that ran.” Gates was also put off by Jobs’s attitude. “It was kind of a weird seduction visit where Steve was saying we don’t really need you and we’re doing this great thing, and it’s under the cover. He’s in his Steve Jobs sales mode, but kind of the sales mode that also says, ‘I don’t need you, but I might let you be involved.’”

Both men were excited by the prospect that Microsoft would create graphical software for the Macintosh that would take personal computing into a new realm, and Microsoft dedicated a large team to the task. “We had more people working on the Mac than he did,” Gates said. And even though Jobs felt that they didn’t exhibit much taste, the Microsoft programmers were persistent. “They came out with applications that were terrible,” Jobs recalled, “but they kept at it and they made them better.”



Gates enjoyed his visits to Cupertino, where he got to watch Jobs interact erratically with his employees and display his obsessions. “Steve was in his ultimate pied piper mode, proclaiming how the Mac will change the world and overworking people like mad, with incredible tensions and complex personal relationships.” Sometimes Jobs would begin on a high, then lapse into sharing his fears with Gates. “We’d go down Friday night, have dinner, and Steve would just be promoting that everything is great. Then the second day, without fail, he’d be kind of, ‘oh shit, is this thing going to sell, oh God, I have to raise the price, I’m sorry I did that to you, and my team is a bunch of idiots’.”


10 ways Steve Jobs changed the world

At the time, Microsoft was producing an operating system, known as DOS, which it licensed to IBM (IBM) and compatible computers. It was based on an old-fashioned command line interface that confronted users with surly little prompts such as C:>. As Jobs and his team began to work closely with Microsoft, they grew worried that it would copy Macintosh’s graphical user interface and make its own version. Andy Hertzfeld, a member of the original Macintosh team, noticed that his contact at Microsoft was asking too many detailed questions about how the Macintosh operating system worked. “I told Steve that I suspected that Microsoft was going to clone the Mac,” Hertzfeld recalled.

They were right to worry. Gates believed that graphical interfaces were the future and that Microsoft (MSFT) had just as much right as Apple (AAPL) did to pursue the desktop metaphor idea that had, after all, had been originally developed at Xerox PARC (XRX), not at Apple. As he freely admitted later, “We sort of say, ‘hey, we believe in graphics interfaces, we saw the Xerox Alto, too’.”

In their original deal, Jobs had convinced Gates to agree that Microsoft would not create graphical software for anyone other than Apple until a year after the Macintosh shipped in January 1983. Unfortunately for Apple, it did not provide for the possibility that the Macintosh launch would be delayed for a year. So Gates was within his rights when he revealed, in November 1983, that Microsoft planned to develop a new operating system for IBM PCs — featuring a graphical interface with windows, icons, and a mouse for point-and-click navigation — called Windows.

Jobs was furious. He knew there was little he could do about it, but he lashed out nonetheless. “Get Gates down here immediately,” he ordered Mike Boich, who was Apple’s evangelist to other software companies. Gates came down — alone and willing to discuss things with Jobs. “He called me down to get pissed off at me,” Gates recalled. “I went down to Cupertino, like a command performance. I told him, ‘we’re doing Windows.’ I said to him, ‘we’re betting our company on graphics interface’.”

Their meeting was in Jobs’s conference room, where Gates found himself surrounded by ten Apple employees who were eager to watch their boss assail him. Jobs didn’t disappoint his troops. “You’re ripping us off!” he shouted. “I trusted you, and now you’re stealing from us!” Gates just sat there coolly, looking Steve in the eye, before hurling back, in his squeaky voice, what became a classic zinger. “Well, Steve, I think there’s more than one way of looking at it. I think it’s more like we both had this rich neighbor named Xerox and I broke into his house to steal the TV set and found out that you had already stolen it.”

From Steve Jobs by Walter Isaacson Copyright © 2011 by Walter Isaacson. Reprinted by permission of Simon & Schuster Inc.

To read more about the fascinating Gates-Jobs relationship, and their poignant final hours together, pick up the November 7 issue of Fortune or purchase the iPad edition of the issue in the iTunes store.

[cnnmoney-video vid=/video/technology/2011/08/24/t_steve_jobs_apple_legacy.fortune]

About the Author
Fortune Editors
By Fortune Editors
See full bioRight Arrow Button Icon
Add Fortune on Google for similar content.

Latest in

Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025

Most Popular

Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Finance
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam
By Fortune Editors
October 20, 2025
Fortune Secondary Logo
Rankings
  • 100 Best Companies
  • Fortune 500
  • Global 500
  • Fortune 500 Europe
  • Most Powerful Women
  • World's Most Admired Companies
  • See All Rankings
  • Lists Calendar
Sections
  • Finance
  • Fortune Crypto
  • Features
  • Leadership
  • Health
  • Commentary
  • Success
  • Retail
  • Mpw
  • Tech
  • Lifestyle
  • CEO Initiative
  • Asia
  • Politics
  • Conferences
  • Europe
  • Newsletters
  • Personal Finance
  • Environment
  • Magazine
  • Education
Customer Support
  • Frequently Asked Questions
  • Customer Service Portal
  • Privacy Policy
  • Terms Of Use
  • Single Issues For Purchase
  • International Print
Commercial Services
  • Advertising
  • Fortune Brand Studio
  • Fortune Analytics
  • Fortune Conferences
  • Business Development
  • Group Subscriptions
About Us
  • About Us
  • Press Center
  • Work At Fortune
  • Terms And Conditions
  • Site Map
  • About Us
  • Press Center
  • Work At Fortune
  • Terms And Conditions
  • Site Map
  • Facebook icon
  • Twitter icon
  • LinkedIn icon
  • Instagram icon
  • Pinterest icon

Latest in

Asia’s defense boom is rewiring the global arms supply chain
Commentaryarms, weapons, and defense
Asia’s defense boom is rewiring the global arms supply chain
By Chris OberoiJune 24, 2026
35 minutes ago
Young couple standing in a brightly lit home
Real EstateHousing
A big look at the state of housing in America: Boomers won’t sell, millennials can’t buy, and Gen Z gets to watch the whole thing sort itself out
By Tristan BoveJune 24, 2026
37 minutes ago
Wind turbines on yellow grass
Environmentwind power
California threatens to hit Trump with lawsuit if he doesn’t revive massive wind farm project off central coast
By Jennifer McDermott and The Associated PressJune 24, 2026
44 minutes ago
How ‘Ozempic face’ is pushing Gen X, already the biggest Botox and filler consumers, to the facelift table a decade early
HealthGen X
How ‘Ozempic face’ is pushing Gen X, already the biggest Botox and filler consumers, to the facelift table a decade early
By Mia OsmonbekovJune 24, 2026
54 minutes ago
Why Zohran Mamdani’s big night as the Democratic party’s new kingmaker matters for every Fortune 500 CEO in every city and state
PoliticsPolitics
Why Zohran Mamdani’s big night as the Democratic party’s new kingmaker matters for every Fortune 500 CEO in every city and state
By Catherina GioinoJune 24, 2026
54 minutes ago
The 4 Best Zinc Supplements of 2026: Expert Tested
HealthDietary Supplements
The 4 Best Zinc Supplements of 2026: Expert Tested
By Emily PharesJune 24, 2026
1 hour ago

Most Popular

After forcing workers back to the office, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase are now letting their staff work remotely—but only for the World Cup
Success
After forcing workers back to the office, Goldman Sachs and JPMorgan Chase are now letting their staff work remotely—but only for the World Cup
By Orianna Rosa RoyleJune 23, 2026
1 day ago
The Pentagon said Iran War costs $29 billion, but the real cost is closer to $200 billion—and counting
Economy
The Pentagon said Iran War costs $29 billion, but the real cost is closer to $200 billion—and counting
By Jacqueline MunisJune 24, 2026
15 hours ago
Amazon's record Prime Day masks a darker truth: Americans are spending more and getting less
Retail
Amazon's record Prime Day masks a darker truth: Americans are spending more and getting less
By Nick LichtenbergJune 24, 2026
7 hours ago
Ray Dalio just finished a 10-day trip to China. He says global leaders know America 'doesn’t have what it takes to fight to maintain its empire'
Asia
Ray Dalio just finished a 10-day trip to China. He says global leaders know America 'doesn’t have what it takes to fight to maintain its empire'
By Nick LichtenbergJune 24, 2026
8 hours ago
Current price of oil as of June 23, 2026
Personal Finance
Current price of oil as of June 23, 2026
By Joseph HostetlerJune 23, 2026
1 day ago
Current price of gold as of June 23, 2026
Personal Finance
Current price of gold as of June 23, 2026
By Danny BakstJune 23, 2026
1 day ago

© 2026 Fortune Media IP Limited. All Rights Reserved. Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy | CA Notice at Collection and Privacy Notice | Do Not Sell/Share My Personal Information
FORTUNE is a trademark of Fortune Media IP Limited, registered in the U.S. and other countries. FORTUNE may receive compensation for some links to products and services on this website. Offers may be subject to change without notice.